The most recent government statistics show that from last April to June cycle deaths and total number of life-threatening injuries has increased by 19 percent from what it was at the same time last year.
So lets be hearing the excuses.
Have I ever told you that I think cycling is quite dangerous?
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Members of the medical profession refer to cyclists as "donors". (Daily Mail)
On Fri, 06 Nov 2009 20:13:50 +0000, Judith M Smith
<judithmsm...@live.co.uk> wrote: >So lets be hearing the excuses.
A fall in motorists, leading to higher average speeds makes motorists more dangerous. They need to install speed cameras at every road junction as that is where motorists routinely kill or injure innocent cyclists.
In article <2l09f5l96cgjm41afn3raus984fk5d7...@4ax.com>, Judith M Smith says...
> So lets be hearing the excuses.
The "have you seen the light" campaign last week saw police out in force in a bid to educate cyclists and motorists about traffic laws.
Together with Cambridge City Council, the enforcement and education campaign was aimed to make sure cyclists and motorists? lights were working properly as the clocks went back.
On TWO NIGHTS, they caught 200 people. Out of that 200, 121 were cyclists who had no lights whatsoever. 51 cyclists were reported for cycling on the pavement and three received fines for other offences with one being reported to the courts.
> Have I ever told you that I think cycling is quite dangerous?
And its usually because of the moron doing the cycling.
Judith M Smith wrote: > The most recent government statistics show that from last April to > June cycle deaths and total number of life-threatening injuries has > increased by 19 percent from what it was at the same time last year.
> So lets be hearing the excuses.
> Have I ever told you that I think cycling is quite dangerous?
It's not the cycling, it's the aggressive motorists that are the problem.
On Fri, 06 Nov 2009 21:04:08 +0000, Tom Crispin put finger to keyboard and typed:
>On Fri, 06 Nov 2009 20:13:50 +0000, Judith M Smith ><judithmsm...@live.co.uk> wrote:
>>So lets be hearing the excuses.
>A fall in motorists, leading to higher average speeds makes motorists >more dangerous. They need to install speed cameras at every road >junction as that is where motorists routinely kill or injure innocent >cyclists.
That wouldn't have any effect, as motorists aren't usually speeding at junctions. You can easily kill someone at 29mph if you aren't looking where you're going and aren't aware of what's around you.
If you want my explanation (not an excuse, since I think that bad driving is always inexcusable), I'd say that it's precisely the automated enforcement of purely technical offences, such as speeding, that is the problem. It's creating a generation of motorists who think that so long as they're within the speed limit they must be driving safely, and removed the incentive for the police to do the job of policing bad driving.
<kije.rem...@this.bit.freeuk.com.munge> wrote: >A fall in motorists, leading to higher average speeds makes motorists >more dangerous. They need to install speed cameras at every road >junction as that is where motorists routinely kill or injure innocent >cyclists.
Tomorrow morning on Radio 4, about 9:30am, this is due to be discussed. Or so I'm told.
Year-to-date figures are 2% higher, with a significant measured increase in cycling, it's only the direct comparison of one quarter with another. Anyone remember what the weather and the economy were like in Q2 2008 compared with Q2 2009? These are small numbers to start with so it's not going to take much to skew them.
But as the commentator said on the news earlier today, it's simply not possible to draw any sensible conclusion from comparing these two particular figures.
In article <4n89f5d4fetfd1ed3lk1iqbok2k7vid...@4ax.com>, Just zis Guy, you know? says...
> Anyone remember what the weather and the economy were > like in Q2 2008 compared with Q2 2009? These are small numbers to > start with so it's not going to take much to skew them.
> Judith M Smith wrote: >> The most recent government statistics show that from last April to >> June cycle deaths and total number of life-threatening injuries has >> increased by 19 percent from what it was at the same time last year.
>> So lets be hearing the excuses.
>> Have I ever told you that I think cycling is quite dangerous?
> It's not the cycling, it's the aggressive motorists that are the problem.
It's the cyclists who think that they are above the law and need not stop at red traffic lights and zebra crossings with people on them, and who try to overtake left-turning vehicles on the left.
I cycle as if I am a human-powered two-wheeled car, obeying all the same laws and rulesand not trying to seek any advantage over cars and lorries by virtue of being narrower or by being untraceable (ie no number plate that can be reprted).
> On Fri, 06 Nov 2009 20:13:50 +0000, Judith M Smith > <judithmsm...@live.co.uk> wrote:
>>So lets be hearing the excuses.
> A fall in motorists, leading to higher average speeds makes motorists > more dangerous. They need to install speed cameras at every road > junction as that is where motorists routinely kill or injure innocent > cyclists.
How the hell does any driver manage to exceed the speed limit at a road junction?
> "Happi Monday" <ha...@munday.com> wrote in message > news:hd24t7$qdh$2@aioe.org... >> Judith M Smith wrote: >>> The most recent government statistics show that from last April to >>> June cycle deaths and total number of life-threatening injuries has >>> increased by 19 percent from what it was at the same time last year.
>>> So lets be hearing the excuses.
>>> Have I ever told you that I think cycling is quite dangerous?
>> It's not the cycling, it's the aggressive motorists that are the >> problem.
> It's the cyclists who think that they are above the law and need not > stop at red traffic lights and zebra crossings with people on them, > and who try to overtake left-turning vehicles on the left.
> I cycle as if I am a human-powered two-wheeled car, obeying all the > same laws and rulesand not trying to seek any advantage over cars and > lorries by virtue of being narrower or by being untraceable (ie no > number plate that can be reprted).
And that is exactly the way I cycle. And I have never been involved in an accident involving a four wheeled vehicle. I did have a mishap once which was the fault of a curb however. Entirely my fault.
<use...@listmail.good-stuff.co.uk> wrote: >On Fri, 06 Nov 2009 21:04:08 +0000, Tom Crispin put finger to keyboard >and typed:
>>On Fri, 06 Nov 2009 20:13:50 +0000, Judith M Smith >><judithmsm...@live.co.uk> wrote:
>>>So lets be hearing the excuses.
>>A fall in motorists, leading to higher average speeds makes motorists >>more dangerous. They need to install speed cameras at every road >>junction as that is where motorists routinely kill or injure innocent >>cyclists.
>That wouldn't have any effect, as motorists aren't usually speeding at >junctions. You can easily kill someone at 29mph if you aren't looking >where you're going and aren't aware of what's around you.
>If you want my explanation (not an excuse, since I think that bad >driving is always inexcusable), I'd say that it's precisely the >automated enforcement of purely technical offences, such as speeding, >that is the problem. > It's creating a generation of motorists who think >that so long as they're within the speed limit they must be driving >safely, and removed the incentive for the police to do the job of >policing bad driving.
>Mark
There's a huge number of incompetent people driving on our roads.
People that are so incompetent they can't in clear dry conditions with no parked cars or traffic in sight ahead of them do 25mph in a posted 30mph limit, 30mph in a 40mph limit. 40mph in a 50mph limit or NSL and actually take HGV's prisioner on all roads. "speed is dangerous"
People that brake becasue they have seen an oncoming vehicle and have to move over from their usual road position with offside wheels 30cm the wrong side of the white line.
People that not only fail to accelerate but brake in the acceleration zone of DC/M-way slip roads even though the road is CLEAR!
People that have had 100+ lessons and 17 tests. Failing 5 times should result in a life time ban. -- Peter Hill Spamtrap reply domain as per NNTP-Posting-Host in header Can of worms - what every fisherman wants. Can of worms - what every PC owner gets!
<peter.usen...@nospam.demon.co.uk> wrote: >People that are so incompetent they can't in clear dry conditions with >no parked cars or traffic in sight ahead of them do 25mph in a posted >30mph limit, 30mph in a 40mph limit. 40mph in a 50mph limit or NSL
When I was at university, I mistakenly thought of an overdraft limit as being a target. Are you making the same error that my young mind made all those years ago with speed limits?
To my mind, there is nothing wrong with driving at half the posted limit.
On Sat, 07 Nov 2009 09:04:36 +0000, Tom Crispin put finger to keyboard and typed:
>On Sat, 07 Nov 2009 08:35:18 +0000, Peter Hill ><peter.usen...@nospam.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>People that are so incompetent they can't in clear dry conditions with >>no parked cars or traffic in sight ahead of them do 25mph in a posted >>30mph limit, 30mph in a 40mph limit. 40mph in a 50mph limit or NSL
>When I was at university, I mistakenly thought of an overdraft limit >as being a target. Are you making the same error that my young mind >made all those years ago with speed limits?
>To my mind, there is nothing wrong with driving at half the posted >limit.
There's nothing wrong with it at all, if that's what the road conditions require. However, driving too slowly for the conditions is a fail on the IAM test, just as much as driving too quickly. It's common courtesy to avoid causing unnecessary delays to people behind you, just as it's common courtesy to give cyclists a wide berth when overtaking them. A good driver thinks about other road users, not just him/herself.
Also, while there's nothing legally wrong with driving more slowly than required by the law or conditions, it is the experience of driving instructors and examiners that doing so is almost always a symptom of a general lack of competance on the part of the driver - and, although driving slowly itself is not particularly dangerous, such people are also more likely to make other types of mistake such as misjudging distances at junctions.
Martin wrote: > "Happi Monday" <ha...@munday.com> wrote in message > news:hd24t7$qdh$2@aioe.org... >> Judith M Smith wrote: >>> The most recent government statistics show that from last April to >>> June cycle deaths and total number of life-threatening injuries has >>> increased by 19 percent from what it was at the same time last year.
>>> So lets be hearing the excuses.
>>> Have I ever told you that I think cycling is quite dangerous?
>> It's not the cycling, it's the aggressive motorists that are the problem.
> It's the cyclists who think that they are above the law and need not > stop at red traffic lights and zebra crossings with people on them, and > who try to overtake left-turning vehicles on the left.
You are absolutely correct - both are big problems and both should be sanctioned.
Amazing video, I've never seen it before. It must have been edited to cut out the numerous crashes which must have happened. Also amazing the number of those idiots NOT wearing crash helmets when they knew what they were about to embark on!
Pity I wasn't about at the time. My reactions are nowhere near good enough to swerve out of the way as a number of those motorists did:-)
<kije.rem...@this.bit.freeuk.com.munge> wrote: >On Sat, 07 Nov 2009 08:35:18 +0000, Peter Hill ><peter.usen...@nospam.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>People that are so incompetent they can't in clear dry conditions with >>no parked cars or traffic in sight ahead of them do 25mph in a posted >>30mph limit, 30mph in a 40mph limit. 40mph in a 50mph limit or NSL
>When I was at university, I mistakenly thought of an overdraft limit >as being a target. Are you making the same error that my young mind >made all those years ago with speed limits?
>To my mind, there is nothing wrong with driving at half the posted >limit.
Well OK if you are on a leisure drive. Why not pull over and let the 3 HGV's and 20 cars that are stuck behind you go past? -- Peter Hill Spamtrap reply domain as per NNTP-Posting-Host in header Can of worms - what every fisherman wants. Can of worms - what every PC owner gets!
On 6 Nov, 21:37, Happi Monday <ha...@munday.com> wrote:
> Judith M Smith wrote: > > The most recent government statistics show that from last April to > > June cycle deaths and total number of life-threatening injuries has > > increased by 19 percent from what it was at the same time last year.
> > So lets be hearing the excuses.
> > Have I ever told you that I think cycling is quite dangerous?
> It's not the cycling, it's the aggressive motorists that are the problem.
<use...@listmail.good-stuff.co.uk> wrote: >On Sat, 07 Nov 2009 09:04:36 +0000, Tom Crispin put finger to keyboard >and typed:
>>On Sat, 07 Nov 2009 08:35:18 +0000, Peter Hill >><peter.usen...@nospam.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>>People that are so incompetent they can't in clear dry conditions with >>>no parked cars or traffic in sight ahead of them do 25mph in a posted >>>30mph limit, 30mph in a 40mph limit. 40mph in a 50mph limit or NSL
>>When I was at university, I mistakenly thought of an overdraft limit >>as being a target. Are you making the same error that my young mind >>made all those years ago with speed limits?
>>To my mind, there is nothing wrong with driving at half the posted >>limit.
>There's nothing wrong with it at all, if that's what the road >conditions require. However, driving too slowly for the conditions is >a fail on the IAM test, just as much as driving too quickly. It's >common courtesy to avoid causing unnecessary delays to people behind >you, just as it's common courtesy to give cyclists a wide berth when >overtaking them. A good driver thinks about other road users, not just >him/herself.
>Also, while there's nothing legally wrong with driving more slowly >than required by the law or conditions, it is the experience of >driving instructors and examiners that doing so is almost always a >symptom of a general lack of competance on the part of the driver - >and, although driving slowly itself is not particularly dangerous, >such people are also more likely to make other types of mistake such >as misjudging distances at junctions.
Woo.
Making a rear observation of the following car. I've seen at least 3 cases in the last month of people turning into junctions so late and wide they are fully in the oncoming lane.
And then there's the turn right to turn left brigade. They swing wide before the turn.
Needs a proper car. -- Peter Hill Spamtrap reply domain as per NNTP-Posting-Host in header Can of worms - what every fisherman wants. Can of worms - what every PC owner gets!
> The most recent government statistics show that from last April to > June cycle deaths and total number of life-threatening injuries has > increased by 19 percent from what it was at the same time last year.
> So lets be hearing the excuses.
> Have I ever told you that I think cycling is quite dangerous?
It would be interesting to hear from the drivers who kill them what they excuses are.
>> On Fri, 06 Nov 2009 20:13:50 +0000, Judith M Smith >> <judithmsm...@live.co.uk> wrote:
>>> So lets be hearing the excuses. >> A fall in motorists, leading to higher average speeds makes motorists >> more dangerous. They need to install speed cameras at every road >> junction as that is where motorists routinely kill or injure innocent >> cyclists.
> How the hell does any driver manage to exceed the speed limit at a road > junction?
Easy -- it's the ones who see an amber light and press the pedal on the right and not the one in the middle*. You don't have to watch -- just listen.
*assuming it's a manuel** gearbox
**assuming it's Spanish gearbox -- Its never too late to reinvent the bicycle
> Of course, that's absolutely typical of all cycling in the UK. And > it's also at least the fourth time someone's posted the link on this > NG. <Yawn>
> --
> Pete
Seems a lot of the scenes (obviously this is extensivly edited) are exactly typical of cyclists behaviour, maybe not all at once, as in the vid but typical nevertheless. 4th time of posting, so what, your attitude of finding the truth boring says it all.
It would be interesting to hear from the drivers who kill them what they excuses are.
Any ideas?
Due to the recession loads of ex-car drivers now use bikes?*** Due to the green hogwash they volunteered to be bikists and died to save the planet? Silly sods think bikes are as safe as cars- just more manouverable so drive on pavements and the wrong way down one way streets?
***Plenty of car drivers are stupid enough to "sneak up" on the side of a juggernaut -BANG - in a car new wing mirror - on a bike death!
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