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Checking Ayn Rand's premises
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acar  
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 More options 5 Nov, 03:50
Newsgroups: humanities.philosophy.objectivism
From: acar <acarm...@mail.com>
Date: Wed, 04 Nov 2009 19:50:50 -0800
Local: Thurs 5 Nov 2009 03:50
Subject: Checking Ayn Rand's premises
Here are some teachings of Ayn Rand as found in "For the New
Intellectual".

> "If man is evil by birth, he has no will, no power to change it;

Ms. Rand needs to check her premise.

The victim has the power to forgive and the subject has the power to
repent. Forgiveness and repentance erase the action, according to a
competing theology, which seems to be more consistent with human
experience. Barack Obama, the ex-pothead, may be cited as an example.
In Ms. Rand's theology humans are either hopelessly doomed or born
without animal instincts. She keeps telling us that there is no such
thing as human instincts. I don't believe her. Do you? She keeps
telling us that perfectly rational men; men able to make the right
choices at all times are walking among us. Do you believe that? I
don't. Yet her entire philosophy rests squarely on those premises.

> if he has no will, he can be neither good nor evil; a robot is amoral.

True. But he has a will to fight his instincts. We don't have to
believe that we are born without animal instincts in order to believe
that we can make good  moral choices. It's a false alternative.

> To hold, as man's sin, a fact not open to his choice is a mockery of morality."

Man's will, and his choices, has had the power to change his genetic
limitations since the beginning of time. He can transport himself in
ten minutes through a distance that would take hours to walk. He has
made his voice and images to reach instantly through thousands of
miles; he can see tiny things and far away constellations. He can even
walk on the moon and come back to tell about it!

Ms. Rand's eloquence and emotion mask the gaping holes in her logic.
It is a fact of experience that man has a tendency to do evil,
regardless of how evil is defined. It is also true that no man can
escape doing evil at some point. But there is such a thing as
redemption through repentance,forgiveness and subsequent choices. The
Christian model appears to be more in line with reality than the
Obectivist model.


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Piet de Arcilla  
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 More options 5 Nov, 05:13
Newsgroups: humanities.philosophy.objectivism
From: Piet de Arcilla <dearci...@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 04 Nov 2009 21:13:17 -0800
Local: Thurs 5 Nov 2009 05:13
Subject: Re: Checking Ayn Rand's premises
On Nov 4, 10:50 pm, acar <acarm...@mail.com> wrote:

> Here are some teachings of Ayn Rand as found in "For the New
> Intellectual".

> > "If man is evil by birth, he has no will, no power to change it;

> Ms. Rand needs to check her premise.

> The victim has the power to forgive and the subject has the power to
> repent. Forgiveness and repentance erase the action, according to a
> competing theology, which seems to be more consistent with human
> experience.

I think she's more right than you. If a person kills someone then
forgiveness and repentance don't change the fact of the murder. And a
tendency or temperament towards violence is not created by will, but
by nature and external influences.

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Charles Bell  
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 More options 6 Nov, 10:32
Newsgroups: humanities.philosophy.objectivism
From: Charles Bell <cbel...@bellsouth.net>
Date: Fri, 06 Nov 2009 02:32:28 -0800
Local: Fri 6 Nov 2009 10:32
Subject: Re: Checking Ayn Rand's premises
On Nov 4, 10:50 pm, acar <acarm...@mail.com> wrote:

> Here are some teachings of Ayn Rand as found in "For the New
> Intellectual".

> > "If man is evil by birth, he has no will, no power to change it;

Yep.

> Ms. Rand needs to check her premise.

Nope.

> The victim has the power to forgive and the subject has the power to
> repent.

Say three Hail Mary's and stick an altar boy in your rectory.

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acar  
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 More options 8 Nov, 22:06
Newsgroups: humanities.philosophy.objectivism
From: acar <acarm...@mail.com>
Date: Sun, 08 Nov 2009 14:06:09 -0800
Local: Sun 8 Nov 2009 22:06
Subject: Re: Checking Ayn Rand's premises
On Nov 5, 12:13 am, Piet de Arcilla <dearci...@gmail.com> wrote:

Piet, you have an interesting name. Are you Spanish? Arcilla is the
Spanish word for a natural earth product very similar to clay. The
only other Piet that I know of is a Dutch cubist painter whose last
name I don't remember.


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