Some may remember my posts over the past year. I had a small bowel tumour removed Fall 2008 and started chemo Dec 2008 and finished May 2009. During chemo I had a long list of side effects, including a pasty mouth with a white film on my tongue. My onc gave me Nystatin but didn't seem to be that effective. It eventually cleared up on its own. During that time as well I had bad heartburn, felt sick often, was hard to eat, burped hours after meals that sounded like I inhaled helium and burped it out etc
The past few weeks the white film on my tongue is back as well as heartburn. Yesterday for example I had lunch at 1pm. At 6pm I had heartburn. I was hungry for supper but still had heartburn. I was also having small burps. Not sure if this is related but my sinuses ache, I have congestion, throat feels sore but looks ok, stinky gas some days, etc All this is cutting into my appetite and slowing my regaining of weight.
I saw my physician 2+ weeks ago and he gave me Nystatin but it didn't seem to work after a week. I went to a walk-in clinic yesterday and saw a Dr I haven't seen before at that clinic and he gave me anti-biotics! ?!?!?
I am on 2 40mg of PPI a day and have been for years due to heartburn caused by my Crohn's. Between surgery and chemo I reduced my PPI's to 1 a day and never had any heartburn. This was due to having most of the bad bowel removed leaving mostly good bowel. I was feeling better than I had in years. I never had a chance to eliminate the PPI last fall as I started chemo which brought back heartburn. I am back on 2 a day to try and control it
Either way, does this sound like yeast? it doesn't make sense to me to have heartburn hours after a meal or the next morning, or to be burping hours after eating/drinking anything. It feels like something is furmenting down there.
Any thoughts?
p.s. I am back to work now full time and getting my life back on track. If I can conquor this nusiance problem I have, I'll be very happy.
Yes, it sounds like a yeast infection, hence the Nystatin. I'd go back to your doctor and tell him/her that the Nystatin is not working and did not work the last time you had something similar. You may need a more powerful anti-fungal. An antibiotic will do nothing for a yeast infection.
> Some may remember my posts over the past year. I had a small bowel tumour > removed Fall 2008 and started chemo Dec 2008 and finished May 2009. During > chemo I had a long list of side effects, including a pasty mouth with a > white film on my tongue. My onc gave me Nystatin but didn't seem to be that > effective. It eventually cleared up on its own. During that time as well I > had bad heartburn, felt sick often, was hard to eat, burped hours after > meals that sounded like I inhaled helium and burped it out etc
> The past few weeks the white film on my tongue is back as well as heartburn. > Yesterday for example I had lunch at 1pm. At 6pm I had heartburn. I was > hungry for supper but still had heartburn. I was also having small burps. > Not sure if this is related but my sinuses ache, I have congestion, throat > feels sore but looks ok, stinky gas some days, etc All this is cutting into > my appetite and slowing my regaining of weight.
> I saw my physician 2+ weeks ago and he gave me Nystatin but it didn't seem > to work after a week. I went to a walk-in clinic yesterday and saw a Dr I > haven't seen before at that clinic and he gave me anti-biotics! ?!?!?
> I am on 2 40mg of PPI a day and have been for years due to heartburn caused > by my Crohn's. Between surgery and chemo I reduced my PPI's to 1 a day and > never had any heartburn. This was due to having most of the bad bowel > removed leaving mostly good bowel. I was feeling better than I had in years. > I never had a chance to eliminate the PPI last fall as I started chemo which > brought back heartburn. I am back on 2 a day to try and control it
> Either way, does this sound like yeast? it doesn't make sense to me to have > heartburn hours after a meal or the next morning, or to be burping hours > after eating/drinking anything. It feels like something is furmenting down > there.
> Any thoughts?
> p.s. I am back to work now full time and getting my life back on track. If > I can conquor this nusiance problem I have, I'll be very happy.
You may be pursuing two contradictory goals. Trying to repair the damage of Crohn's often means trying to jump start the creation of new tissue. This is typically contrary to the goals of chemotherapy. Very few substances can accomplish both goals: vitamin D3, butyrate, inulin, perhaps carnitine. Other agents that fight inflammation and regeneration tissue like folic acid or growth hormone could have disastrous consequences with your personal history of cancer.
I'm in the middle of writing a paper that pertains to chronic fungal infections and their contribution to autoimmunity and impaired gut healing. I'll try to summarize the research. Basically, bacteria and fungi coexist in a healthy G.I. tract. Chronic inflammation, chronic antibiotic use, poor nutrition and other factors can disturb this balance. Individuals with Crohn's frequently have inadequate friendly gut bacteria colonies and that helps prevent the proper regulation of inflammation, leading to the breakdown in gut barrier function. Fungal overgrowth can result and can inhibit several natural healing pathways. To restore the balance you don't just need to use antifungals, you need to stop feeding sugar to the fungi and you need to reintroduce friendly bacteria into your gut. Inulin (pre-biotics) and probiotics will help with the later. If Nystatin doesn't help with killing the fungus, you can try stronger antifungals. There are some "natural" antifungals available over-the-counter: oregano extract, thyme oil, grapefruit seed extract, olive leaf extract and so on. Some of these also have antibiotic problems, so that can be a problem. Don't take the antibiotics at the same time you take the probiotics - they'll kill them.
Yeast do notoriously well on a standard American low-fiber, high sugar diet. Get on a low-G.I. diet. That may mean eating high fiber foods that Crohn's doctors tell you to avoid. How this will affect G.I. motility I can't say. I can tell you that the traditionally low fiber, high sugar/starch foods like potatoes are horrible for people with chronic inflammation and fungal infections - yet doctors advise people with TMJ and Crohn's to eat these foods because they are "soft." You might be able to compromise with a soluble fiber - or, better yet, with something like inulin.
Finally, there is a direct molecular connection between the fungal infection and your autoimmunity: the tryptophan-degrading enzyme, indoleamine 2,3-dioxygenase (IDO; inhibited by tryptophan). IDO is an innate immune factor used both to fight fungal infections and maintain immunotolerance. Its loss would lead to chronic fungal infections/sensitivity and autoimmunity. T-cells need tryptophan to function. When you are low in tryptophan, they don't work. In order for immunopriviliged tissues like hair follicles to escape T-cell attack, they synthesize IDO which eliminates local T-cell attack. More than that, thought, IDO can directly activate your regulatory T-cells. Butyrate can activate transcription of IDO - and it's formed by the digestion of fiber by friendly gut bacteria. Carnitine helps your cells metabolize butyrate. Since tryptophan inhibits IDO and turkey is rich in IDO, perhaps these foods should be avoided by the autoimmune. You might also want to avoid iron-rich food since this may inhibit cathelicidin production via HIF-1alpha, but that's another topic I'm working on in my paper.
____________________________________
based on studies in rats with Candida inoculation and acetic acid injury with and without Lactobacillus acidophilus and based on clinical observations of human patients with IBD, gastric ulcer and UC, significant fungal colonization (SFC) impairs G.I. healing while probiotics helps reduce inflammatory damage; Candida upregulated IL-1beta and TNF-alpha (compare this with the cytokine profile/Candida issues in male-pattern baldness); Lactobacillus acidophilus therapy shortens the duration of fungal colonization of mucosa (enhanced Candida clearance is associated with IL-4, INF-gamma response) [PMID 17242486], antifungals also improve recovery from colonic TNBS injury in rats along with probiotics; serum IL-1beta and TNF-alpha levels drop; Candida more frequently colonized patients with a history of UC within a 5-year period, when compared with those of shorter duration of IBS; among Candida strains colonizing intestinal mucosa, Candida albicans was identified in 91% of cases; significant inhibition of the UC activity index as reflected by clinical, endoscopical and histological criteria was observed in the Candida group treated with fluconazole, when compared to that without antifungal treatment; in the animal model, Candida infection significantly delayed the healing of TNBS-induced UC, decreased the CBF and raised the plasma IL-1beta and TNF-alpha levels, with these effects reversed by fluconazole or lacidofil treatment [PMID 19439813]
based on studies in rats with Candida inoculation and acetic acid injury with and without Lactobacillus acidophilus and based on clinical observations of human patients with IBD, gastric ulcer and UC, significant fungal colonization (SFC) impairs G.I. healing while probiotics helps reduce inflammatory damage; Candida upregulated IL-1beta and TNF-alpha (compare this with the cytokine profile/Candida issues in male-pattern baldness); Lactobacillus acidophilus therapy shortens the duration of fungal colonization of mucosa (enhanced Candida clearance is associated with IL-4, INF-gamma response) [PMID 17242486]
I was thinking about you the other day and wondering how you were getting along. It is great to hear that you are back at work and getting your life sorted out. Long may it continue.
I am not an expert, but ideally if it doesn't clear up with anti-fungals and antibiotics, a swab of your tongue and throat taken should be taken to find out exactly what is going on. The sinus problem would indicate to me that you might have a sinus infection causing sinusitis - most likely bacterial and in that case the antibiotics would work. Fungal infections are a difficult issue and can sometimes take many months to get rid of. One is supposed to clean one's tongue routinely. Are you drinking your 2 litres each day? If not, this might help you considerably as it will help get your system balanced http://healthmad.com/home-health/what-to-deal-with-a-white-tongue-coa...
A high dose of PPIs over a long period of time can result in changes in the flora and fauna of the gut. That, together with the chemotherapy, probably resulted in a massive change in your gut environment and everytime you change your medication you gut flora and fauna balance changes. Another consideration ís that you might be short of vital nutrients. For example, long-term PPI treatment results in vitamin B12 deficiency. It might be a good idea to have at least vitamin B12 and folic acid levels checked as vitamin deficiencies reduce the body's resistance to infection. You might need a booster vitamin B12 jab and perhaps folic acid.
Are you taking a zinc supplement - strengthens the immune system. I had low zinc levels in 2002 and was told to supplement with zinc by my docs.
Chemotherapy results in reduced absorption of nutrients. A children's sublingual vitamin tablet might be a good idea to supplement your diet if you are not on Ensure or any other fortified drinks - discuss with your doctor.
Try a couple of small pots of natural yoghurt with live Lactobacillus - if you have a lot of wind with this, it will indicate that you probably have developed a secondary lactose intolerance due to the resections. Hard cheeses have less lactose in them than soft cheeses. Milk can worsen reflux because of its high fat content - remove the water and what do you have, even with low fat milk? You could also remove dairy from your diet for a couple of days to check for lactose intolerance.
> Some may remember my posts over the past year. I had a small bowel tumour > removed Fall 2008 and started chemo Dec 2008 and finished May 2009. During > chemo I had a long list of side effects, including a pasty mouth with a > white film on my tongue. My onc gave me Nystatin but didn't seem to be > that effective. It eventually cleared up on its own. During that time as > well I had bad heartburn, felt sick often, was hard to eat, burped hours > after meals that sounded like I inhaled helium and burped it out etc
> The past few weeks the white film on my tongue is back as well as > heartburn. Yesterday for example I had lunch at 1pm. At 6pm I had > heartburn. I was hungry for supper but still had heartburn. I was also > having small burps. Not sure if this is related but my sinuses ache, I > have congestion, throat feels sore but looks ok, stinky gas some days, etc > All this is cutting into my appetite and slowing my regaining of weight.
> I saw my physician 2+ weeks ago and he gave me Nystatin but it didn't seem > to work after a week. I went to a walk-in clinic yesterday and saw a Dr I > haven't seen before at that clinic and he gave me anti-biotics! ?!?!?
> I am on 2 40mg of PPI a day and have been for years due to heartburn > caused by my Crohn's. Between surgery and chemo I reduced my PPI's to 1 a > day and never had any heartburn. This was due to having most of the bad > bowel removed leaving mostly good bowel. I was feeling better than I had > in years. I never had a chance to eliminate the PPI last fall as I started > chemo which brought back heartburn. I am back on 2 a day to try and > control it
> Either way, does this sound like yeast? it doesn't make sense to me to > have heartburn hours after a meal or the next morning, or to be burping > hours after eating/drinking anything. It feels like something is > furmenting down there.
> Any thoughts?
> p.s. I am back to work now full time and getting my life back on track. > If I can conquor this nusiance problem I have, I'll be very happy.
Does sound like yeast to me - I have colitis and I know I get very sick when I eat too much sugar. I drink peppermint tea with fresh ginger in it whenever I fell nausea or heartburn coming on. Works great for me! BTW - I am NOT on ANY medication for this disease... I take only herbal supplements and try to eat a VERY healthy diet and I feel great most of the time... I am trying to beat this disease - with the help of the natural medicine community.
On Nov 6, 7:04 am, "CD Minon" <noem...@no.com> wrote:
> Some may remember my posts over the past year. I had a small bowel tumour > removed Fall 2008 and started chemo Dec 2008 and finished May 2009. During > chemo I had a long list of side effects, including a pasty mouth with a > white film on my tongue. My onc gave me Nystatin but didn't seem to be that > effective. It eventually cleared up on its own. During that time as well I > had bad heartburn, felt sick often, was hard to eat, burped hours after > meals that sounded like I inhaled helium and burped it out etc
> The past few weeks the white film on my tongue is back as well as heartburn. > Yesterday for example I had lunch at 1pm. At 6pm I had heartburn. I was > hungry for supper but still had heartburn. I was also having small burps. > Not sure if this is related but my sinuses ache, I have congestion, throat > feels sore but looks ok, stinky gas some days, etc All this is cutting into > my appetite and slowing my regaining of weight.
> I saw my physician 2+ weeks ago and he gave me Nystatin but it didn't seem > to work after a week. I went to a walk-in clinic yesterday and saw a Dr I > haven't seen before at that clinic and he gave me anti-biotics! ?!?!?
> I am on 2 40mg of PPI a day and have been for years due to heartburn caused > by my Crohn's. Between surgery and chemo I reduced my PPI's to 1 a day and > never had any heartburn. This was due to having most of the bad bowel > removed leaving mostly good bowel. I was feeling better than I had in years. > I never had a chance to eliminate the PPI last fall as I started chemo which > brought back heartburn. I am back on 2 a day to try and control it
> Either way, does this sound like yeast? it doesn't make sense to me to have > heartburn hours after a meal or the next morning, or to be burping hours > after eating/drinking anything. It feels like something is furmenting down > there.
> Any thoughts?
> p.s. I am back to work now full time and getting my life back on track. If > I can conquor this nusiance problem I have, I'll be very happy.
A friend of mine has colitis (I have Crohn's) and has rejigged her diet. In the course of experimenting and testing various foods she has found that drinking around 1l fennel tea per day results in a noticeable improvement of her symptoms. However, she is still on Prednisolone and 5-ASAs.
I am interested in exploring other avenues. The only thing I currently do that is complementary is a bit of aromatherapy - lavender scent is very relaxing and I have baskets of potpourri scented with an expensive organic lavender oil. The cheap stuff is not to be recommended. I occasionally drink camomile, fennel and apple tea, but usually drink a couple of litres of water throughout the day and a glass of diluted pineapple juice in the morning. I chill out quite a bit too. I have tried a number of other herbal remedies, e.g. St. John's Wort, but they either give me abdominal cramps or exacerbate my GERD.
A Tip: A drop of lavender oil on the corner of a square of kitchen towel, which is then rolled up from the corner with the drop of oil on it to the opposite corner and then tied to form a loose knot and put under one's pillow might help one sleep. Caveat: use too much oil and it will have the reverse effect. Aromatherapy oils can burn one's skin and one shouldn't get undiluted oil on the skin, polished furniture, paintwork or clothing.
I can't drink peppermint tea because of my reflux and can't eat ginger because of my short bowel syndrome. Ginger, aniseed, nettle, coffee - all exacerbate diarrhoea. There is a good section on diet in this paper:
Like yourself I watch my diet. I only eat home-cooked food (OK, I sin occasionally); removing artificial flavourings and the like has helped me. I also notice when products have a lot of cheap fat in them - my reflux goes out of control and I feel sick to my stomach. Sweets and really fatty foods make me really sick. I don't buy cheap biscuits or cake anymore. I am lactose intolerant, so I can't eat ice cream, milk or soft cheeses. I do OK on a bit of hard cheese and plain yoghurt with steamed fruit. I try and follow a mediterranean diet, which is supposed to be anti-inflammatory, anyway a modicum of good cold-pressed virgin olive oil as often as possible and a couple of portions of oily fish each week.
Vanny
"Coach Tristin" <coachtris...@gmail.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag news:8d784ec6-ea53-4e7c-8312-2bcadf146106@v15g2000prn.googlegroups.com... Does sound like yeast to me - I have colitis and I know I get very sick when I eat too much sugar. I drink peppermint tea with fresh ginger in it whenever I fell nausea or heartburn coming on. Works great for me! BTW - I am NOT on ANY medication for this disease... I take only herbal supplements and try to eat a VERY healthy diet and I feel great most of the time... I am trying to beat this disease - with the help of the natural medicine community.
On Nov 6, 7:04 am, "CD Minon" <noem...@no.com> wrote:
> Some may remember my posts over the past year. I had a small bowel tumour > removed Fall 2008 and started chemo Dec 2008 and finished May 2009. During > chemo I had a long list of side effects, including a pasty mouth with a > white film on my tongue. My onc gave me Nystatin but didn't seem to be > that > effective. It eventually cleared up on its own. During that time as well I > had bad heartburn, felt sick often, was hard to eat, burped hours after > meals that sounded like I inhaled helium and burped it out etc
> The past few weeks the white film on my tongue is back as well as > heartburn. > Yesterday for example I had lunch at 1pm. At 6pm I had heartburn. I was > hungry for supper but still had heartburn. I was also having small burps. > Not sure if this is related but my sinuses ache, I have congestion, throat > feels sore but looks ok, stinky gas some days, etc All this is cutting > into > my appetite and slowing my regaining of weight.
> I saw my physician 2+ weeks ago and he gave me Nystatin but it didn't seem > to work after a week. I went to a walk-in clinic yesterday and saw a Dr I > haven't seen before at that clinic and he gave me anti-biotics! ?!?!?
> I am on 2 40mg of PPI a day and have been for years due to heartburn > caused > by my Crohn's. Between surgery and chemo I reduced my PPI's to 1 a day and > never had any heartburn. This was due to having most of the bad bowel > removed leaving mostly good bowel. I was feeling better than I had in > years. > I never had a chance to eliminate the PPI last fall as I started chemo > which > brought back heartburn. I am back on 2 a day to try and control it
> Either way, does this sound like yeast? it doesn't make sense to me to > have > heartburn hours after a meal or the next morning, or to be burping hours > after eating/drinking anything. It feels like something is furmenting down > there.
> Any thoughts?
> p.s. I am back to work now full time and getting my life back on track. If > I can conquor this nusiance problem I have, I'll be very happy.
> The past few weeks the white film on my tongue is back as well as heartburn. Yesterday for example I had lunch at 1pm. At 6pm I had heartburn. I was hungry for supper but still had heartburn. I was also having small burps. Not sure if this is related but my sinuses ache, I have congestion, throat feels sore but looks ok, stinky gas some days, etc All this is cutting into my appetite and slowing my regaining of weight. Any thoughts? p.s. I am back to work ...
What is your typical diet these day? Is it different than before the problems started? I get a heartburn about 4 to 5 hours after eating offending foods (which includes just about everything, even peppermint and ginger). If I eat grains, my joints grind and tongue develops a whitish film. If I eat a banana, tongue burns, hand numbs, heartburns and eye irritation follow. Lentils, lettuce, zuchinni and a small amount of lean meat offends me the least.
Hi Jay. No, my diet is no different. The only big variable was chemo. Before chemo I was great. Since chemo I have not been. At times I've been pretty good, but not as good as I was before chemo.
Vanny, thanks for your reply again. Nice to know someone, even if I haven't met you, was thinking of me! I am seeing a new GI now, who I saw a few days ago. She is going to run various blood tests, do the endoscopy and upper GI to see if we can't find the source of my problem. My previous GI didn't seem overly concerned and figured I was good to go without seeing him for 6 months when I saw him late summer. My new GI has a good personality, asks questions, and rather find the problem and treat it right than throw medication at something we don't know what it is.
You are a good resource to this group Vanny, I am sure you have helped many here. Take care
> The past few weeks the white film on my tongue is back as well as > heartburn. Yesterday for example I had lunch at 1pm. At 6pm I had > heartburn. I was hungry for supper but still had heartburn. I was also > having small burps. Not sure if this is related but my sinuses ache, I > have congestion, throat feels sore but looks ok, stinky gas some days, etc > All this is cutting into my appetite and slowing my regaining of weight. > Any thoughts? p.s. I am back to work ...
What is your typical diet these day? Is it different than before the problems started? I get a heartburn about 4 to 5 hours after eating offending foods (which includes just about everything, even peppermint and ginger). If I eat grains, my joints grind and tongue develops a whitish film. If I eat a banana, tongue burns, hand numbs, heartburns and eye irritation follow. Lentils, lettuce, zuchinni and a small amount of lean meat offends me the least.
I am pleased to have been able to help. I am vegging away at home on disability and just being able to support others through my own experience by bouncing various ideas around here has given me some purpose in life. More so when I learn that I have, indeed, been able to help some small way.
I just wanted to remind you that it can take up to a year to recover from chemotherapy. This is stated in the literature and I can confirm it from my personal experience. I stopped 6-MP (Crohn's low dose 50 mg daily) last December and it took a couple of months for the liver pains to dwindle away and the general feeling of having been poisoned for over two years.
You are in a catch 22 situation because your body is still trying to right itself after your serious illness and the hefty chemotherapy sessions; at the same time every secondary infection that you can think of is trying to take advantage of the situation. I bet that you will feel significantly better in 6 months time, but that doesn't help you now.
I really do hope that your new doctor is able to help you. I would also put money down on various vitamin deficiencies and you might need to receive a few vitamin injections depending which part of your ileum you have had removed. Vitamin B12 deficiency is fairly common in Crohn's patients. Vitamin D is also a major contender because the majority of westerners have low vítamin D due to low exposure to the sun and you will not have been able to go out into the sun because of the chemo. As you experienced chemotherapy causes massive gut and hence nutritional problems in the majority of patients with resulting deficiencies of most vitamins and the usual vitamin tablets will be useless in the short-term because the gut is still not working properly.
The situation can be complicated by the fact that the vitamin levels in the blood can be hunky dory, but only because it has helped itself to the vitamin stores in various unimportant organs to feed the most important organs. An example of B12 deficiency that went undetected by doctors: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-1197979/Heartburn-pills-wre...
> Hi Jay. No, my diet is no different. The only big variable was chemo. > Before chemo I was great. Since chemo I have not been. At times I've been > pretty good, but not as good as I was before chemo.
> Vanny, thanks for your reply again. Nice to know someone, even if I > haven't met you, was thinking of me! I am seeing a new GI now, who I saw > a few days ago. She is going to run various blood tests, do the endoscopy > and upper GI to see if we can't find the source of my problem. My previous > GI didn't seem overly concerned and figured I was good to go without > seeing him for 6 months when I saw him late summer. My new GI has a good > personality, asks questions, and rather find the problem and treat it > right than throw medication at something we don't know what it is.
> You are a good resource to this group Vanny, I am sure you have helped > many here. Take care
> "jay" <jaym1...@hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:0e43c9b2-2e68-4af8-9576-81b80b06ede6@n35g2000yqm.googlegroups.com... >> The past few weeks the white film on my tongue is back as well as >> heartburn. Yesterday for example I had lunch at 1pm. At 6pm I had >> heartburn. I was hungry for supper but still had heartburn. I was also >> having small burps. Not sure if this is related but my sinuses ache, I >> have congestion, throat feels sore but looks ok, stinky gas some days, >> etc All this is cutting into my appetite and slowing my regaining of >> weight. Any thoughts? p.s. I am back to work ...
> What is your typical diet these day? Is it different than before the > problems started? I get a heartburn about 4 to 5 hours after eating > offending foods (which includes just about everything, even peppermint > and ginger). If I eat grains, my joints grind and tongue develops a > whitish film. If I eat a banana, tongue burns, hand numbs, heartburns > and eye irritation follow. Lentils, lettuce, zuchinni and a small > amount of lean meat offends me the least.
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